Can AI Prepare Your Martech Stack for Healthcare Consumerism?

Webinar

Featuring

Hileman Group

Description

A few years ago, we all wondered about the potential for AI. Now, we can examine its impact and determine what technologies will be best for our organizations and consumers!

Fitting the right marketing technologies into an organization’s strategy can be extremely complex work. Tom Hileman, Hileman Group’s founder, helps systems like Cleveland Clinic and Baylor Scott & White solve these very same challenges.

Tom digs deep on the technologies to be aware of right now and how to integrate them into culture.

Want to learn the right mix of strategy and technology as consumerism becomes the make-or-break factor in healthcare?

Tom Hileman

Tom Hileman

President
Hileman Group

Hileman Group
Chris Hemphill

Chris Hemphill

VP, Applied AI & Growth
Actium Health

Actium Health logo
Ann Stadjuhar

Ann Stadjuhar

VP Sales
Actium Health

Actium Health logo
1

Transcript



Chris Hemphill:
All right, we’re on. We’ve crossed over to the other side. Hello, Healthcare. Hello, LinkedIn. Hello, YouTube. However you are viewing us here to let you know that we’re live and the subject matter, always, always excited about the topics, but we’ve been on a consumerism kick lately. And that started out with what’s the overall landscape of disruptors entering the field and what are some of the characteristics that they’re using to define the new consumer experience that patients have. The direction that we’re going on this conversation is around the technologies from the marketing technology stack and potentially the relationship that AI plays as well in defining these consumer experiences, creating these new ways, these new modalities by which people are going to be accessing care and creating kind of that relationship and know me experience. To help us with that, Ann is our VP of sales here at SymphonyRM. So big hello from you, Ann.

Ann Stadjuhar:
Hello, thank you for joining today.

Chris Hemphill:
And our guest of the moment we brought in Tom Hileman, who runs the Hileman Group and has major experience with marketing technology stacks at all kinds of organizations. So he’s worked heavily with Baylor Scott & White, Cleveland Clinic, and what we thought would be exciting for the audience, especially with all the people here who have been trying for years, are focused for years on being able to put the consumer experience front and center. Tom has done this and led this at a number of organizations. He’s got a great background in data-driven and statistic driven marketing, and he’s here to answer questions and talk with you directly. So hello everybody in the audience. We just want to let you know that this is an open conversation, as Tom says things that you’re curious about, or you have stories that you can relate that you just want to share. Let’s hear them, put them out in the chat and we’d love the back and forth. But Tom, just to kick it off, could you tell us a little bit about your background, what the Hileman Group is and what you’re focused on?

Tom Hileman:
Thanks, Chris. Thanks, Ann. Thanks for having me and I appreciate everybody online and the various channels making some time today. So as you can probably tell, I’m pretty passionate about marketing technology and data, and we’ll get into that heritage a bit, but Hileman Group, we focus on helping healthcare organizations connect with their patients and their physicians essentially, and patient consumer side driving patient communications, acquisition, retention, and whatnot, and then on the provider side, more broadly physicians or clinicians in general, connecting with them as well in that part of the value chain.

Chris Hemphill:
Excellent. And out of curiosity, when you started the firm, what were the tenants or what was the impetus behind this focus that you’re bringing to healthcare?

Tom Hileman:
So interesting. So I’m a recovering physicist. So my training is in physics and mathematics. So I view the world through the lens of science, and data and analytics. So I guess if you had a physicist design a marketing agency, Hileman Group is what you get. So the tenants are was really understanding and looking at marketing from a more scientific perspective. And back 20 years ago, that wasn’t really a thing. Marketing was much more brand oriented research in that space, but as the technologies have evolved and the data has proliferated, we are now able to track essentially almost all activities in the digital space and the tools that we have today are just so far beyond what they were before. So marketing’s truly measurable. You can be truly impactful.

Tom Hileman:
You can personalize, you can test at scale. So my opinion in the next 5-10 years of marketing is the most exciting time we’ve ever been alive in terms of all the tools that we’ll be able to do, but also as a marketer, our ability to fundamentally help people, our ability to communicate with them and healthcare, I’m particularly passionate about because we can do good and do well here together. Help patients get to the right care. Some things that in artificial intelligence, I’m sure we’ll talk about the ability to find patients who may need particular help with certain services, whether it be kidney cancer or diabetes and some of the things we can do data science to really help and communicate with folks to help them get the best quality of life they can.

Tom Hileman:
So fundamental tenants have always been kind of data, the underlying process orientation around marketing, the marketing technology and then of course the core piece of all this is the messaging. We talk why data and science at the bottom of line we have to have a brand and we have to have a great message for people. And putting that all together is what Hileman Group’s all about.

Chris Hemphill:
Of all the places that you could have focused on, all the industries you could have focused on, we’re really happy that you’re bringing that focus into healthcare and focusing on not just it could have been a situation where it’s about optimizing clicks to watch movies and things like that, but this is a real impact that it sounds like you’re very focused on. To get things started, we always have a diverse audience. There are people in marketing who might be familiar with marketing technology, but on the other side there’s other people that… I believe that marketing technology because there’s so much data being collected on how people interact with various materials of various subjects and things like that. I think it’s something that should be made more aware of across the organization. So could you help us and give us your definition, your thoughts on what marketing technology is and how it relates to the consumer experience?

Tom Hileman:
Sure. That’s a pretty broad statement. So marketing technology are all you probably hear me they can do, it’s a single word MarTech. I view that as essentially anything that you use, mostly we’re going to talk about technology software or online systems and technology data to essentially organize and execute your marketing. So MarTech is really the underpinning of how you get your message out. The core fundamentals of marketing are audience, message, call to action. So MarTech is the basic underpinning of executing on that in the digital realm. So what does that mean? It could be things like your content management system if you’re publishing in a web based world, or headless content if you’re thinking about mobile apps in different deployments, different devices, it could be a marketing automation platform kind of orchestrates that, it could be a simple email marketing system, or it could be a CRM where you’re collecting the data or about 50 other things.

Tom Hileman:
Chief MarTech had I think at 8,000 MarTech adtech systems that that was being tracked in 2020. So in ’21, I’m sure it’s probably 9,000 or more. Lots of pieces that make up the MarTech. In terms of the consumer experience, the way I typically look at MarTech is it needs to support in healthcare what that patient journey we want the patient to take is. So the MarTech shouldn’t be the underlying support for either delivering those messages, information in a timely manner, right message, right person, right time. That issue orchestrating that we’re tracking the pieces of it so you get the data to be able to understand that patient and personalize the message scale.

Chris Hemphill:
Excellent perspective. And Ann, I was wondering about your thoughts.

Ann Stadjuhar:
I think the MarTech stack has always been incredibly difficult from the standpoint of the acronyms and the question of what a CRM actually is, and having a lot of different just definitions in the marketplace. I think we’re getting a little bit closer to what that MarTech stack should certainly look like and the components that are needed. There’s no doubt that there is more and more out there from the standpoint of the startups and standpoint of the organizations that are able to provide a lot of different solutions to the healthcare marketers. But I think what’s really important is having a very good strategy on exactly what is needing to be accomplished and how you’re going to lay all of that out going forward, and what works together. I think it’s incredibly important too for the vendors that are in that MarTech ecosystem to have good collaboration as we get into interoperability and the things that are occurring there.

Ann Stadjuhar:
It’s really important that we can all hold hands and help our partners out and help our clients out too, and in seeing the most of their spend and also understanding the journey of the patient and keeping that as seamless as possible without too many challenges in the data in the way a lot of this is flowing with all of these multiple systems now, working together getting it into as we call ourselves symphony here, getting it into a nice orchestration takes a lot of work and a lot of collaboration.

Ann Stadjuhar:
So I think, Tom, one of my questions too would be here we are, we’ve had a couple of decades of really a marketing focus historically on fee for service and the service line marketing reality. And I think we’ve been living with our feed in two different boats of fee for service versus value value-based care. And now as we move into that value based care environment more and more what happens in marketing and what are some of the technologies that you’re seeing or some of the strategies that you’re seeing that are now beginning to influence the marketing departments with value based care?

Tom Hileman:
Yeah, that’s a great question. And I think we’re still not terribly far along the value value-based care curve I would argue, just given how the current market trends are. Now, it’s a very different model. Fee for service is volume, volume, volume, and specific volumes in specific areas. And there’s nothing wrong with that value from the perspective of those patients need to be served. But from a marketer’s perspective, it makes you myopically focused on a part of a patient’s journey and fitting people into hundreds of different small buckets of where they fit geography, condition and procedure and driving towards that. And when you think about value-based care, you think about the whole person, and you think about what that continuum of care through the life of that patient is. So I think we need both.

Tom Hileman:
I don’t think we’ll ever actually go to a whole value based care or go back to a whole fee for service model because I think there’s points to both of those pieces. As a marketer I think value-based care actually makes us look more holistically at a patient. Population health becomes incredibly important as healthcare organizations have to determine how they best care for populations and how you keep them healthy as opposed to get fixed them when they’re sick. So that’s the mentality from a marketer that we have to think about more of the whole person and what’s that kind of continuum of care look like and focus less on sick care and more on healthcare. Dr. Cosgrove, former CEO of Cleveland clinic used to always argue that we need to be a healthcare organization means well care, not sick here. And of course, some people are going to have acute conditions that are going to be sick care because you break your arm that’s not necessarily a wellness activity or some of those kinds of things. But from a marketer perspective, I think it makes us look at the whole patient journey.

Tom Hileman:
It makes us think holistically about that lifetime value becomes very important as a concept. Some other industries have done that with much more success than the healthcare has. And I think if we think about the continuity of that, that’s an aspect that we need to promote. Secondarily, no other industry has caregivers. So that layer is something that’s much different in healthcare. So value-based care also has to encapsulate the caregivers, both the healthcare workers, but also the caregivers of the friends, family who are supporting folks through that journey. So I think as marketers we have to think about the whole person and even beyond the person, their whole sphere of people who help support them as well and help them through that life cycle of care and keeping people healthy as opposed to fixing folks who are sick, which is still important, of course, because people are going to get sick no matter what, but it changes the mix of some of the messaging and how we think about how we reach patients.

Chris Hemphill:
So Tom, you mentioned a whole host of different marketing related technologies. And we’re also talking about this whole and complete perspective of the patient. I’m curious, if we were to look at commonly used technologies or even data sources that marketing uses for its purposes, but is kind of under utilized when we look at the population health perspective, are there any technologies in the marketing technology stack that it seems like should be more widely adopted across the organization and the data that comes from it more viewed across the organization? I’m a curious about where marketing can fit into this picture and where some components are undervalued by by leaders.

Tom Hileman:
No, that’s a great question and it’s a hard one to answer. But I’ll give it my attempt here. I think one of the things that I see really is I know people talk about AI all the time. We talk about it a lot but we’re not really using it all that much or not even near to what its potential is from that perspective. So I think in healthcare we’ve got piles of data and it’s almost like we have rooms that we just scoop data into. If you think about all the interactions that we have with your digital, there’s digital engagement analytics from web and mobile, social, all those advertising, all those pieces. If you think about the personal encounters that we have, the EMR systems, claims data, all this. So we have more than enough data in healthcare. We don’t really even need more data I would argue.

Tom Hileman:
What we need is information and I think the difference between the two is that information tells us something useful about the data. So I think AI is actually vastly under utilized in healthcare today. We’re seeing very simplistic applications of it. And I don’t mean it in a pejorative way. So like Google, they have their optimizing AI in terms bid costs and whatnot. And that’s a fine use, but that’s not nearly enough. We have data that we can help patients to understand who they are, where they are, what they even may have from a disease condition likelihood, incidents of care, getting in for annual wellness. We have all this data that we can be using.

Tom Hileman:
So data to me is vastly underused. I also think marketing automation systems are vastly underused. People think of them as kind of batch and blast email. Well, marketing automation does way more than that orchestrating the patient’s journey through the healthcare system with the right information at the right time. They’re woefully underused even when you’re putting it in a larger enterprise tool. I think there’s a couple areas. I actually think text messaging is massively underused specifically to reach populations that may not have smartphones, which are typically underserved areas of our patient demographics.

Tom Hileman:
So almost everyone has text messaging and has access to those things. So I think there’s some pretty fundamental things. The good news is though, is we have tons of tools and I think we have… my comment is off the old quote, “Water, water everywhere, but not a drop the drink.” We’ve got data, data and tools everywhere but how do we as marketers really effectively use those and also avoid shiny object syndrome of looking at whatever the coolest, latest craze is? So I think those are the three that I think to me that are pretty much underused today.

Ann Stadjuhar:
Tom, I think about it and obviously you’re a strategist, no doubt and you work with some of the largest and best healthcare systems in the country. And when you look at the strategy component about just where to start in getting clarity with some of this and having a good path for getting the technology and everything integrated and reaching the patients appropriately, what do you recommend for some of the leaders on this call and at organizations in terms of a good starting point and in building some of this out?

Tom Hileman:
Well, that’s a great question. So I think sometimes we throw tools at things, some [inaudible 00:17:06] hatchets throwing them against the wall and we sometimes mistake tools for strategy, or we’re going to adopt some new system and that’s going to solve the issue when the reality is, is not really going to solve the issue. So tools are great and we need them. But what we need to think about is what the… Almost all my opinion of the world of organizations for profit, nonprofit comes down to three things, mission, vision values. What are we here to do? Who are we here to serve? And what do we believe in? In healthcare it’s the most fundamental of that. You look at the tenants in healthcare education of patients is critical.

Tom Hileman:
One of my friends who’s a doctor always tells me that, “Every patient should follow the creative. They need to be an active participant in their own rescue.” So if there’s someone sick, then we need the patient to be involved both from an education understanding, but also involvement in diet, exercise, nutrition, taking medications, all those things. So I think strategy starts with who do we serve? How do we serve them best? And then we layer what the organization, what our goals are, whether that’s to grow the organization size, or the reach of the people that we serve and how do we serve them in an excellent way? I think that when you start with strategy, you need to start with fundamentals of what are we here to do today. And I use that very broadly, what’s the organization here to do?

Tom Hileman:
Who are we here to serve? And how are we going to do that? And then the marketing where we live marketing comes about how do we deliver that message? How do we reach the people that we want to reach? How do we delight those folks and serve them in the best possible way? And I think the strategy should always be about how do we do those things and how do we do them in the best way? And then the tools, and the tech, and the data that all follows that. Strategy should always lead. Strategy and culture to me should always lead in the organizations and the tools, technology support that. Now the tools are really important because if you’re trying to chop down a tree and you’re trying to do it with pocket knife, it might take a little while.

Tom Hileman:
So it’s important to get the right tool for the right job, but the tool shouldn’t decide what the job is. If you’re going to chop a tree we should decide that that’s missing the objective, and then we go find the right tool for that. And I think a lot of times organizations we get it backwards. We think about a shiny object, the shiny tool, a CRM system, or what it might be. And then we think that’ll solve the problem. But at the end of the day, strategy has to be about the people, the process and the technology to deliver what the value is for that organization.

Chris Hemphill:
So I’m 100% hearing what we’re saying about if technology is leading the ship, then it becomes shiny object syndrome. There’s so much technology coming out on a monthly basis that if just having the best technology is a priority and it’s not related to the strategy, then we’re just going to be all over the place. So it makes me curious about if you take that story, that concept of focusing on strategy and using tech to support that, could you point to maybe an organization or a leader who does that particularly well and kind of what’s most important in their stack and basically how they influence these decisions?

Tom Hileman:
Yeah. There’s a lot of folks doing a lot of great work in healthcare for sure. And one of the folks I’m privileged to work with is Paul Matson at Cleveland Clinic. He’s a very strategic thinker and worked with him for a long time. And I think one of the important things I learned from him is the importance of keeping your message short when you’re guiding and leading people. He often talks about digital, mobile, measurable. So everything needs to be digital, everything needs to be measurable and everything has to be able to point wherever people are. This is the mobile part of that. And I think that the ability to just take that almost to a mantra of where you’re heading, so that when people are looking at making decisions, they have a framework for that.

Tom Hileman:
So I think that’s leading with strategy from his perspective, and working with them, they’ve done a great job. They have a gigantic content engine that they build and do some great work with just in reaching patients and educating and having content that both reaches different audiences. They reach patients for basic education. They reach clinicians, physicians with that targeted information. So I think that patient education, I think they’ve done a great job to building out that content and then also leveraging some great marketing technology, marketing automation, and whatnot to get that message out to the right people at the right time. So I think they’ve done a great job. Paul, I’ve been fortunate to present with him in a couple of conferences and some of the work that they’ve done. I think they do a great job with it. Lots of organizations are doing it in different areas. And I think they’re a good example of kind of doing it well in the space that they operate in an academic medical center space.

Chris Hemphill:
Ann, I know that you’ve worked in this space for an extremely long time with marketing technologies and have seen, but just wanted to get your perspective on that question as well. I know you put out the initial question on what leaders might be able to do, but I think that you’d probably have some valuable perspective and thoughts on getting started with these data-driven initiatives and maybe if there are anybody that you could think of as well.

Ann Stadjuhar:
In terms of the goals of the organization and everything like that, and the strategy, Tom, I, 100% agree that it should start with the mission, vision, values type of reality. And so many folks I think have a very complex message that they’re trying to get out to the market based on where they’re really out. Are they a value-based care organization? Have they taken on risk? Ultimately all of them are driving care for patients and their communities and that’s incredibly important. And you see organizations like even some of the Geisingers of the world that are out there and how they’re reaching out and how they’re messaging and educating their populations about their health. And it’s not necessarily I think about utilization of the hospital, it’s about things like diet, or food as medicine, or being able to just really be a resource for their communities too in treating whether it’s an underserved population, whether it’s some of the social determinants of health. But understanding they’re part of the community.

Ann Stadjuhar:
And I’ve even seen some things like farmer’s markets and food deserts that have been brought in by the hospitals in their parking lots and things like that in some of the Southern California communities. Doing things that go, I think a little bit above and beyond your regular traditional service and marketing is a lot of what I find inspiring. And what I like to think about some of the caregivers in the community, my hospital is a caregiver and nurturing and taking care of our population and having that bond and that relationship, I think that goes beyond a hospital bed is incredibly important. Because again, nobody likes to be sick. Undoubtedly marketing and hospitals are trying to advertise for something that nobody wants to use at the end of the day.

Ann Stadjuhar:
It might take some of their pain away and some things like that, but it’s an incredibly hard marketing task to encourage people to ultimately have surgery. So the struggle is real on that front. But what I see is, again, truly inspiring is that people that realize that well care, that health, the community, that they belong to, even participation in the events and things like that for screenings and taking people’s blood pressure and getting that underserved population actually in for some care, I think is incredibly important and inspiring.

Tom Hileman:
Yep. 100% agree with that. There are a lot of healthcare organizations are taking kind of non-healthcare roles in their societies, whether you said it’s nutrition or whether it’s simple education. I was at the Stephanie Tubbs Jones facility in East Cleveland and they have a commercial kitchen in there which has a bunch of different ranges and different equipment where they teach folks [inaudible 00:25:49] when they’re pregnant on different nutrition for them and how they can make that in their own kitchen. And they have a test kitchen essentially there. That wouldn’t be considered healthcare in most normal senses of the word. But being able to provide the ability to show folks how to do nutritious meals with fruits, vegetables, and actually cooking it there together with clinicians, it’s pretty innovative and solving some really important issues when it comes to nutrition and health. And it’s a traditional way to do that.

Ann Stadjuhar:
Definitely non-traditional I think is always the trick and where it could be a little bit more inspiring and you see these true leaders doing things that are a little bit out of the box and not the typical to help solve, I think some of healthcare’s problems. So I know that one of the conversations is that we’ve been discussing AI and AI initiatives in MarTech too. I do think sometimes AI can be a little bit of a overused or scary word for people and what does it really mean and how do we get leaders to really adopt it and define it and not necessarily be exhausted by it is key. But Tom, what are some of your thoughts in talking to the leaders out there and how they’re using intelligence more and more in their adoption of AI?

Tom Hileman:
Yeah. I think it’s a daunting prospect. You have people who talk about are the robots coming for us. And what does artificial intelligence really mean? And it’s probably widely misunderstood. I think most organizations we best suited if they picked up fairly narrow area to start and pilot there. Because there’s a lot of internal concerns in a healthcare organization when you bring up the word AI. We have data and we have a lot of privacy and data around that. So how do we navigate through that? So there’s a legal aspects of that, there’s some organizational aspects of data silos and who owns what and what are we doing with what? So I think most folks are best started with a more narrow focus of where to improve what AI will bring.

Tom Hileman:
So whether we’re looking at patient reactivation, great place to start. Everybody wants to bring patients back who may not be back for the care that they need. It’s a great way to start with something that people can understand and then show what AI brings to the table and how you can sift through all that data and find meaningful information and meaningful action out of it. So we have all this data, but we have to take the right action. Now that’s a really loaded term, the right action. What does that mean? What’s the next thing that we’re going to communicate or interact with the patient on? That’s probably one of the biggest and hairiest problems that a healthcare system has because there’s so much they could do from their online portals such as a MyChart and an Epic Systems, to outbound texting communications, to patient wellness, to driving a primary care visit or preventative screening, mammography or colonoscopy.

Tom Hileman:
So that to me that’s the bigger problem, but to get to that, we’ve got to solve some of the more narrow ones and get people to understand what AI brings and I think if I were starting off, I would start very narrow, get parties to agree, talk about specific objectives, come out of that, show success because AI brings a level of scale that we can’t do as humans or as individual marketers, and then from there scale to the broader context. But I think you really have to crawl, walk, run this one specific with the very conservative nature of most healthcare organizations getting them to understand what AI means and what it isn’t.

Chris Hemphill:
Very inspired by that piece of advice, starting narrow I would say is one of the major components that when we look at installations or things that have failed, a lot of it has been because there’s just been too much trying to be addressed at the onset rather than looking at it approach, looking at where there are some metrics and there’s some instruments that we can use and we can see how effectively we’re able to move that metric. So that advice you just gave really resonates with me.

Tom Hileman:
Great.

Chris Hemphill:
We’re at the bottom of the hour and still some [inaudible 00:30:21] on and I really appreciate that when we have a conversation going, sometimes it goes a little bit over, but we appreciate everybody who’s just come in and hung out with us and just showed the interest and enthusiasm around consumer experience, AI and a lot of things that Tom has been bringing to the table.

Chris Hemphill:
But we are at our point where it’s time to conclude and get some final thoughts. One thing that’s always interesting is with every guest that we bring in, Tom, you didn’t have to be here, you could’ve been doing something else, there’s a lot of other stuff that you could have been doing, but I always feel like there’s a reason that you’d come on here and have a discussion with us. And especially with your ideas on a scientific approach to bettering engagement, bettering care. I’m just curious just your thoughts on anything that you’d like for people to be able to take away from this conversation, the reason that you came in here, what were you looking to leave people with here?

Tom Hileman:
Well, thank you and thanks Chris and Ann for having me. I appreciate it and hopefully the audience has gotten some value out of it. One of the reasons that I like to do these kinds of events is just to share, we’re in a fortunate spot that we get to work with lots of different health systems and lots of different marketing technology and creative aspects. So I think we have a pretty good wide perspective and humbling. I made a lot of mistakes in my career and I hopefully people can learn from things, as you mentioned, we talked about the narrow focus. Every time I’ve tried to do a boil the ocean program, then that will be failed because the ocean is an awful big place. It takes a lot of energy to get that boiling. So I’m hoping to share a little bit of lessons learned so that other folks can hopefully avoid some missteps and maybe move a little quicker on things.

Tom Hileman:
But I think I’d leave people with is to really, the last 12 to 15 months it has been a very frenetic time and there’s been a lot of concern about loved ones, ourselves, our society, and the way we operate has changed radically. And now it’s starting to kind of come back into what the new normal will be. But I think that one of the things that I’ve learned over the last 15 months is to be very intentional about your planning and what you do. So I’d say as marketing leaders who may be watching this is, just be intentional and think about what your current goals are. Take a step back. We’ve all been in the fight against COVID specifically in healthcare messaging. I’m sure all the health care organizations here have been impacted and/or have been trying to communicate to patients, customers, whoever they may be about coronavirus and vaccines and all those good things.

Tom Hileman:
So we’ve been in a firefight for a while and we’ll be for a bit more. So it’s important [inaudible 00:33:05] sometimes take a step back and be intentional and to broaden our thinking. So I would encourage everyone to look at their goals and use this as a moment to take a step back and think about the people they need to reach those goals, the process, the technology that they need to do, and just look at it from a holistic perspective. There’s tons of technology so we have all the tools that we need today. Tools will get better and continue to grow and innovate as we always do.

Tom Hileman:
But at the end of the day, most work gets done because someone put some thought into how it should be organized with very intentional about the team that they built to execute against that and to do the right thing. So I guess I’d leave people to be intentional and take a step back today, on a Friday and think about your goals going forward, whatever they may be and I think that they’ll see it for sure people pretty well the time and place we are at today.

Ann Stadjuhar:
Thanks so much for joining us today, Tom, I really appreciate it. And we always love our partners and the opportunity to speak with them about marketing technologies and the digital transformation and everything that’s taking place. And I, 100% agree with you. We’re in a new place starting after the pandemic. A lot has happened in this past year and we look forward to the acceleration of moving forward.

Chris Hemphill:
Excellent. And I also wanted to say, thanks Tom, for joining. And I hope that advice resonates. I hope that maybe anybody watching could carve out maybe 10, 20, 50 minutes to really think back and reflect. We can get really scattered. If your mission is written down and your goals are written down, I know that we can get really scattered from that. And being able to focus in, and narrow in all the tasks and activities, make sure that those were on point, that’s always a good way to end the week and reflect. So thanks for bringing that to the table. One of the highlight, a couple of things that we have coming up next week, we will have a webinar with Alan Shoebridge and Dean Browell who’ve recently written a book called Don’t You Forget About Gen X and their impact on healthcare.

Chris Hemphill:
So all my Gen Xers out there, my millennials too, my boomers too, my Gen Zers, everybody come on, join us. We’ll be talking about generation X and the impact on healthcare and relating to that audience, but that’s going to shine a lens on everybody too generationally. So we’re really excited to have that one. And then following that, we have a conversation coming with Chris Bevolo who wrote the book, Joe Public Doesn’t Care About Your Hospital. So lots of awesome, exciting things coming up and thank you for joining us and look forward to seeing you soon.

Ann Stadjuhar:
Thanks so much.

Tom Hileman:
Thank you.
 

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